Posted by Philosopher on September 13, 1999 at 12:31:12:

In Reply to: The existence of God. posted by Christopher on September 11, 1999 at 09:28:32:

First, St. Thomas was a master of logic, so it supremely ignorant to blithely label his arguments as illogical.

Second, before taking up the question of proving God's existence, St. Thomas first prooves that it is possible to offer proofs of God's existence; in other words, that faith alone is insuficient to establish God's existence. In fact, it is the position of all Thomistic scholars, and indeed of the Catholic Church that God's existence is not merely an article of faith, but rather one that can be proven by reason.
Third, if anyone doubts this then consider that St. Thomas bases his proofs on the work of Aristotle, who was a pagan, and hadn't the influence of a theistic culture, yet who concluded that there must be some kind of sumpreme being.
Finally, try it for yourself. There is motion and this motion must have started somewhere; therfore, there must be a Prime Mover. This is simple logic. If this kind of logic and reason are denied--even if to affirm the value of faith--then all we are left with are leaps of faith, so we could never know if what we land on is solid ground.

Follow Ups:

• Re: The existence of God. christopher 09:12:17 9/17/99 (14)
  • Re: The existence of God. Philosopher 11:37:31 9/17/99 (13)
    • Re: The existence of God. Rob Lent 10:35:51 9/21/99 (5)
      • Re: The language of physics isn't the same as philosophy Philosopher 10:29:52 9/29/99 (4)
        • Re: The language of physics isn't the same as philosophy Yola Bola 05:24:59 8/26/100 (0)
        • Re: The language of physics isn't the same as philosophy Joel 22:19:52 10/23/99 (2)
          • Re: The language of physics isn't the same as philosophy Joseph 18:25:59 11/26/99 (1)
            • Re: The language of physics isn't the same as philosophy Andrew 22:04:20 1/03/100 (0)
    • Freud Oediupus 05:44:03 9/19/99 (6)
      • Re: Freud, So what? Philosopher 12:43:21 9/19/99 (5)
        • You draw a conclusion The Sip'n Fly 23:17:49 9/21/99 (2)
          • Re: You draw a conclusion Philosopher 12:11:47 9/27/99 (1)
            • Got a Question for Philosopher Joel 22:51:47 10/23/99 (0)
        • Re: Freud, So what? oedipus complex 08:54:12 9/21/99 (1)
          • Freud Philosopher 11:58:35 9/27/99 (0)

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Comments:
: First, St. Thomas was a master of logic, so it supremely ignorant to blithely label his arguments as illogical. : Second, before taking up the question of proving God's existence, St. Thomas first prooves that it is possible to offer proofs of God's existence; in other words, that faith alone is insuficient to establish God's existence. In fact, it is the position of all Thomistic scholars, and indeed of the Catholic Church that God's existence is not merely an article of faith, but rather one that can be proven by reason. : Third, if anyone doubts this then consider that St. Thomas bases his proofs on the work of Aristotle, who was a pagan, and hadn't the influence of a theistic culture, yet who concluded that there must be some kind of sumpreme being. : Finally, try it for yourself. There is motion and this motion must have started somewhere; therfore, there must be a Prime Mover. This is simple logic. If this kind of logic and reason are denied--even if to affirm the value of faith--then all we are left with are leaps of faith, so we could never know if what we land on is solid ground.

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